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AbyssUnderground
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Joined: 31 Dec 2004
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 Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 6:15 pm Post subject: Server keeps freezing |
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My server keeps randomly freezing and when I told a friend about it he said its nesessary to "burn in" a new cpu. Basically running it at 100% power for about 24 hours. I didn't beleive him until he sent me a link (i lost it :-( ).
Is this true or is he having me on? He said he has used it himself but Im not totally sure he was telling the truth.
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Andy (AbyssUnderground) (previously The Inquisitor)
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MonkeyNation
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Joined: 05 Feb 2005
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 6:25 pm Post subject: |
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I don't believe so, from my experience.
I've used AMD and Intel processors that will stay up for well over a fortnight fresh after being built. Although, I've never used your exact type of processor.
By freezing to you mean BSODs or litterally freezing?
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AbyssUnderground
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 6:26 pm Post subject: |
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| MonkeyNation wrote: | I don't believe so, from my experience.
I've used AMD and Intel processors that will stay up for well over a fortnight fresh after being built. Although, I've never used your exact type of processor.
By freezing to you mean BSODs or litterally freezing? |
Literally freezing, the mouse stops, no keyboard responce, websites dont work, nothing, zip.
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MonkeyNation
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 6:29 pm Post subject: |
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| The Inquisitor wrote: | | MonkeyNation wrote: | I don't believe so, from my experience.
I've used AMD and Intel processors that will stay up for well over a fortnight fresh after being built. Although, I've never used your exact type of processor.
By freezing to you mean BSODs or litterally freezing? |
Literally freezing, the mouse stops, no keyboard responce, websites dont work, nothing, zip. |
Is it perhaps overheating? Could be a faulty driver or two, too.
Otherwise, see if the same happens on a different OS or in safe mode.
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AbyssUnderground
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 6:31 pm Post subject: |
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Its not overheating, the cpu is running at 30*c according to the bios, the software that came with the MB and MBM5.
As for drivers, Im suspecting the GFX drivers but Ive upgraded them today and its still doing it.
There should be nothing wrong with Windows XP so its not the OS.
EDIT: Im trying the burning in malark, it might work.
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MonkeyNation
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 6:34 pm Post subject: |
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| The Inquisitor wrote: | Its not overheating, the cpu is running at 30*c according to the bios, the software that came with the MB and MBM5.
As for drivers, Im suspecting the GFX drivers but Ive upgraded them today and its still doing it.
There should be nothing wrong with Windows XP so its not the OS.
EDIT: Im trying the burning in malark, it might work. |
It's not unknown for systems to install improperly.
Infact, with XP, I find there's about a 1 in 10 chance of getting a perfect install. (I.E. One that won't develop weird problems 3 months down the line.)
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AbyssUnderground
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 6:35 pm Post subject: |
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Ive never had an install go bad on me yet. Maybe just your bad luck ;-)
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Andy (AbyssUnderground) (previously The Inquisitor)
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MonkeyNation
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 6:37 pm Post subject: |
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| The Inquisitor wrote: | | Ive never had an install go bad on me yet. Maybe just your bad luck ;-) |
Stands to reason that you might be yet to have a good one. But it is most likely my dodgy copies.
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Anonymoose
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 8:20 pm Post subject: |
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Not sure where they got this idea from, but the idea of having to 'burn in' every new CPU for 24 hours is ridiculous. If you buy a prebuilt system you may get a document indicating that a burn in test has been completed, but this is more for the supplier to be confident that they all the parts in your machine are working correctly when delivered than any requirement for this to be done before the machine will work properly. I have built more than 100 systems for use in house and never had to run a 24 hour burn in before a machine will work. If I am using a totally new component (ie never used one before, not one that is brand new but has identical versions working fine in other machines), I will run a burn in test just for my own assurance that the new hardware is stable, but not to get it to work.
Have you tried running any tests while in safe mode? If the machine is totally locking up with no BSOD or logs in the Event Log, I'd say it is more likely to be a fundamental hardware problem than any driver related issue. If the machine freezes in safe mode it is definitely *not* a driver issue. I would look at bad memory, or badly seated components as your first port of call.
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AbyssUnderground
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| Posted: Fri Dec 16, 2005 8:32 pm Post subject: |
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OK. Ive not tried it in safe mode yet but if it does it again I will. Im doing a burn in process as I type this message. Its been running for about 2 hours now. It hasnt crashed as of yet so it might be doing some good. Time will tell.
I remember this happening with my other server when I first got it, a week or so later it was completely fine. The memory is fine, I know this for a fact because Ive used it in my Dads machine with no problems. The memory tests also complete successfully.
The parts came seperately so I had to combine/put them together so maybe no burn test was done?
Ill see what happens after the burn test is completed.
EDIT: As you can see from my sig the server is at 100% load during the test.
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richardyork
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| Posted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 9:53 am Post subject: |
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Hi Andy,
Just noticed that your using the 128MB Radeon 9200SE graphics card. I have one of these in my most recently built computer and I'm still having problems with it now!! After a clean install of Windows XP the screen becomes very jumpy e.g. scrolling down in IE isn't a smooth action etc. After visiting M$ Windows Update and downloading the suggested driver, the computer will randomly crash and just reboot! As for drivers from ATi, I havn't had chance to try them yet.
I havn't had a good experience with this card at all!!
Hope it's different for you!
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AbyssUnderground
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| Posted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 10:50 am Post subject: |
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The burn in test crashed as soon as i tried to use the server to install another program. But its run overnight successfully.
I honestly dont know whats wrong with it. Ive tried updating the drivers for the graphics card. Today Im going to try a totally different card. One that uses generic drivers to start with. After all, its only a server and doesnt need them.
The card has worked fine for me in the past, just this pc does it.
Also, could it be possible I damaged the power supply when the old motherboard fried? I was looking at MBM and the -12v is all over the place, -2,-6, -11, -7, -3, -5... but in the motherboards voltage monitor it doesnt use -12v so is it lying?
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168pin
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Joined: 09 Mar 2005
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| Posted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 1:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Anonymoose wrote: | | Not sure where they got this idea from, but the idea of having to 'burn in' every new CPU for 24 hours is ridiculous. If you buy a prebuilt system you may get a document indicating that a burn in test has been completed, but this is more for the supplier to be confident that they all the parts in your machine are working correctly when delivered than any requirement for this to be done before the machine will work properly. I have built more than 100 systems for use in house and never had to run a 24 hour burn in before a machine will work. If I am using a totally new component (ie never used one before, not one that is brand new but has identical versions working fine in other machines), I will run a burn in test just for my own assurance that the new hardware is stable, but not to get it to work. |
I'm the guy who suggested it, because it can help to track down the cause of problems, etc, as found on a page I gave andy, but don't have the link to right now, that detailed why you would want to do a burn-in. The point is, he's having problems, we're not sure what part is causing it, so we stress different parts of the computer, and see when it crashes. Sounds simple and rational enough to me...
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AbyssUnderground
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| Posted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 3:35 pm Post subject: |
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OK, ive given up. Now I cant even get to the desktop before it feezes. Im going to send it back and get something else. Im not getting a replacement because knowing my luck it wont work either.
Im setting up a SCSI server as I type so this one might work. Its only 500MHz but at least its faster than the other backup server.
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p3
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Joined: 17 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 3:37 pm Post subject: |
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| The Inquisitor wrote: | OK, ive given up. Now I cant even get to the desktop before it feezes. Im going to send it back and get something else. Im not getting a replacement because knowing my luck it wont work either.
Im setting up a SCSI server as I type so this one might work. Its only 500MHz but at least its faster than the other backup server. |
And, unfortunatley, all hostes sites are down.
That means:
ANDY - HURRY THE HELL UP!
:D |
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AbyssUnderground
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| Posted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 3:38 pm Post subject: |
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| p3 wrote: | | The Inquisitor wrote: | OK, ive given up. Now I cant even get to the desktop before it feezes. Im going to send it back and get something else. Im not getting a replacement because knowing my luck it wont work either.
Im setting up a SCSI server as I type so this one might work. Its only 500MHz but at least its faster than the other backup server. |
And, unfortunatley, all hostes sites are down.
That means:
ANDY - HURRY THE HELL UP!
:D |
Im doing the best I can. My site is down as well so its bad for me too.
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Andy (AbyssUnderground) (previously The Inquisitor)
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AbyssUnderground
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| Posted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 4:54 pm Post subject: |
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Right, server number 3 for this week is now up and running *ugh*
Lets hope this one keeps working...
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Anonymoose
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| Posted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 5:08 pm Post subject: |
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| 168pin wrote: |
I'm the guy who suggested it, because it can help to track down the cause of problems, etc, as found on a page I gave andy, but don't have the link to right now, that detailed why you would want to do a burn-in. |
That's a perfectly good reason to do a stress test, but isn't the same as a burn in test - it's also different from the reason Andy gave.
| The Inquisitor wrote: | | My server keeps randomly freezing and when I told a friend about it he said its nesessary to "burn in" a new cpu. |
Just a misunderstanding...
| The Inquisitor wrote: |
I remember this happening with my other server when I first got it, a week or so later it was completely fine. The memory is fine, I know this for a fact because Ive used it in my Dads machine with no problems. The memory tests also complete successfully.
The parts came seperately so I had to combine/put them together so maybe no burn test was done? |
2 things - if you haven't bought a prebuilt machine, obviously it won't have had a proper burn in test done on all the parts, but all new parts should have passed manufacturers own quality control and testing. Any secondhand parts you have lying around should be tested well before putting into a production server.
The memory is a tricky one - modern motherboards may drive memory more aggressively than older PCs. Also each board may drive memory slightly differently. Try changing the memory settings to a lower speed in the BIOS - eg if the memory is 2700 DDR, lower the speed to 2100. I have a few machines where the memory refuses to run stably at rated speed. The memory working well in one machine is no guarantee it will work perfectly in another. You also shouldn't rely on the basic BIOS memory test to confirm memory is OK if it isn't brand new.
| The Inquisitor wrote: |
Also, could it be possible I damaged the power supply when the old motherboard fried? I was looking at MBM and the -12v is all over the place, -2,-6, -11, -7, -3, -5... but in the motherboards voltage monitor it doesnt use -12v so is it lying? |
I'd boot into the BIOS screen, assuming it can give you information on the voltages. Leave it running there and keep an eye on it. If the 12v rail really is fluctuating that much, you have a bad PSU. This will *definitely* cause problems. Do you have a spare PSU lying around you can test with?
| The Inquisitor wrote: |
I honestly dont know whats wrong with it. Ive tried updating the drivers for the graphics card. Today Im going to try a totally different card. One that uses generic drivers to start with. After all, its only a server and doesnt need them.
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You haven't mentioned whether you have tried running the machine in safe mode yet... This will run the card with a generic driver, disable unnecessary services and anything else which may cause stability problems within Windows.
You also haven't mentioned the specific motherboard you picked up... Any known problems when you google it?
Think I've covered everything, but if there's anything I didn't, give me a shout.
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AbyssUnderground
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| Posted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 5:14 pm Post subject: |
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1. All components worked fine prior to the new system.
2. I changed the speed of the memory several times.
3. I checked in the BIOS and it doesnt display -12v so I assume it doesnt use it. Tried a different power supply anyhow and it still had the same problem.
4. Didnt try safe mode but did change the GFX card to one that is flawlessly working in another computer. Same problem.
Ive given up now, ive requested an RMA and was accepted so its being sent back as soon as I can get to the post office.
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Anonymoose
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| Posted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 5:22 pm Post subject: |
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| The Inquisitor wrote: | 1. All components worked fine prior to the new system.
2. I changed the speed of the memory several times.
3. I checked in the BIOS and it doesnt display -12v so I assume it doesnt use it. Tried a different power supply anyhow and it still had the same problem.
4. Didnt try safe mode but did change the GFX card to one that is flawlessly working in another computer. Same problem.
Ive given up now, ive requested an RMA and was accepted so its being sent back as soon as I can get to the post office. |
1. As I said, same components, different system can still lead to incompatibility problems.
2. Well done!
3. Totally incorrect. The 12V line will definitely be in use. If this isn't reported normally by the BIOS, it probably is being reported incorrectly in MBM sensors.
4. If it's freezing in safe mode, I'd say an RMA was a good idea, but you haven't really ruled out your own secondhand bits.
What motherboard did you purchase? Big brand? Cheapo?
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AbyssUnderground
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Anonymoose
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| Posted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 5:38 pm Post subject: |
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Not a bad little board, see how the RMA goes... I swore I'd never use another SiS chipset motherboard after the last Athlon board (K7S5A, IIRC) I had with one gave me nothing but problems. Hopefully things have improved since then!
BTW, If the +12V is in use, the -12V is in use, whether it reports it or not ;)
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AbyssUnderground
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| Posted: Sat Dec 17, 2005 5:39 pm Post subject: |
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Oh, right. You learn something new every day ;-)
My last server board was a SiS board. Lasted me a while. Anyway the board is ready to send back to them. As long as I get my refund Im happy.
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